KronTalk

General => General high-speed discussion => Topic started by: hutber on February 04, 2022, 02:36:52 AM

Title: Lens needed to film sports?
Post by: hutber on February 04, 2022, 02:36:52 AM

Hey guys

I'm considering getting my first 2.1 but this would almost exclusively only for filming Football (soccer) in the UK under natural sunlight.

But I have my reservations that its possible to record players that might be 20m away, and have enough light in a lens.

I'm pretty excited by this prospective!

Title: Re: Lens needed to film sports?
Post by: hutber on February 04, 2022, 02:51:14 AM

Interestingly I didn't know about the points you have made here:
https://forum.krontech.ca/index.php?topic=501.msg2803#msg2803

So some lens will get a black border if on 1000fps at HD res. Scary lol

Title: Re: Lens needed to film sports?
Post by: chrissie_c on February 04, 2022, 08:01:55 AM

I filmed some slow-mo cricket (no comments please :-) using a 200mm Nikon Lens and it worked pretty well. That's equivalent to 400mm in old money so quite a useful length. It does need to be a very sunny day to use a lens of that length, so with football you might find the weather is less amenable. Maybe a speedbooster would help with that.

Title: Re: Lens needed to film sports?
Post by: hutber on February 04, 2022, 08:04:12 AM

Amazing thank you pal!

What is a speed booster :D?

I would love to see some of the footage if you had it readily available!

Title: Re: Lens needed to film sports?
Post by: chrissie_c on February 05, 2022, 07:02:26 AM

I don't have any of those shots to hand, I'll have a look though! I lost a few slowmos in a drive crash a few months ago so I have a horrible feeling they were a victim of that.

Speed boosters are a way of getting more light out of a lens that covers a larger area than your camera sensor. If you get a full-frame lens (I tend to get old Nikon ones on ebay - they're relatively cheap, especially if you find one with a broken auto-focus as I did once) then they cover twice the area of the Chronos sensor - which is half-frame (micro 4/3 size). What a speed booster does (I THINK), is to channel that extra light, that would normally be lost around the outside of the 4/3 sensor, into the sensor so you get more than the advertised f-number of the lens.

Someone might come along with a better explanation, but thats my understanding at least.

Slow motion uses a LOT of light so the more you can get out of a lens, the better. I don't use speed boosters myself, partly because they are expensive and mainly because I mostly use the Chronos indoors or the back garden (where I can use lights) or on sunny days.

Title: Re: Lens needed to film sports?
Post by: chrissie_c on February 05, 2022, 07:05:42 AM

BTW don't worry too much about that forum post. They're talking about C mount lenses there which tend to be for much smaller sensors than the 2.1. My advice (for what it's worth) is to use the Nikon mount that comes with the camera and use SLR lenses. That way they will always cover the sensor, usually with some to spare - hence speedboosters.

Title: Re: Lens needed to film sports?
Post by: hutber on February 06, 2022, 04:10:16 PM

Interesting!! Thank you very very much :)
So in a way, just buy and play? But opt for manual f-stops?

Title: Re: Lens needed to film sports?
Post by: chrissie_c on February 07, 2022, 12:53:11 AM

> So in a way, just buy and play? But opt for manual f-stops?

In my case yes. The Chronos is a totally manual camera, so you don't have the option here - There no auto focus and no auto exposure.

Not sure if it's any help, but I found some outside footage, it's not sports (sorry) but was of a subject around 20m away :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6o4dyruyryo

Title: Re: Lens needed to film sports?
Post by: hutber on February 07, 2022, 01:06:19 AM

Oh hell ye that is nice!! That has been the main thing I am worrying about truth be told. Distance shots :D Thanks

Title: Re: Lens needed to film sports?
Post by: hutber on February 08, 2022, 02:21:36 AM

So I think I need this then?
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fotodiox-Mount-Adapter-Nikon-Camera/dp/B00T0QVLL2/ref=sr_1_4?crid=2XGI128FLC9SN&keywords=nikon+f+to+c&qid=1644315613&sprefix=nikon+f+to+c%2Caps%2C64&sr=8-4

Nikon F > C right? With Aperture control.

Title: Re: Lens needed to film sports?
Post by: hutber on February 08, 2022, 07:51:25 AM

I've been looking around now for some speed boosters and I'm guessing I need Nikon to C-Mount for it? However, in a way it makes no sense as I cannot find any to C-Mount :)

Title: Re: Lens needed to film sports?
Post by: Nikon1 on February 08, 2022, 08:35:43 AM

There are no Speedboosters with C-Mount. You need to go with MFT Mount on the Camera Side and Whatever fits the Lenses you plan on Mounting on the Other Side.

Title: Re: Lens needed to film sports?
Post by: hutber on February 08, 2022, 08:40:41 AM

Ahh ok, great. So its Lens > speed boaster > c-mount adaptor basically. Must more clear thank you!

Title: Re: Lens needed to film sports?
Post by: Nikon1 on February 08, 2022, 08:52:15 AM

Quote from: hutber on February 08, 2022, 08:40:41 AM

Ahh ok, great. So its Lens > speed boaster > c-mount adaptor basically. Must more clear thank you!

Not Quite right. But almost.
 While you can kind of do that, and Adapters for that do in Fact exist:
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BeM7cTJuSm4
 https://rafcamera.com/adapter-mft-to-cs-mount
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rxkxCpFMPfs
 I would Highly recommend to use A Interchangeable Mount for the Chronos like a MFT-Mount, as that is just way more Reliable, mechanically Stable and User-Friendly.
 Krontech offers one for sale, some users including me made their own Designs, and i also posted a bunch of Stuff on the Forum to either Build yourself one to 3D-Print (Parts for the Published Design are not available anymore, but you should be able to modify that to whatever Parts you can find on Ebay) or to Make a custom Spacer for the Metabones Speedbooster (posted in the Same Thread, but never finished Posting that one, only about half way done, will finish posting that, if anyone asks me to).
 
 

Title: Re: Lens needed to film sports?
Post by: hutber on February 08, 2022, 02:15:12 PM

Ahh you are very informative for me, thank you!

I did not realise there was a CS-Mount. So Ideally I would buy this mount you have linked, and then buy this adaptor https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fotodiox-Adapter-Compatible-F-Mount-CS-Mount/dp/B07VDM5CQP/ref=sr_1_3?crid=2OAMY4DP71R27&keywords=nikon+to+CS-mount&qid=1644358081&sprefix=nikon+to+cs-mount%2Caps%2C75&sr=8-3 for my Nikon lens I already have.

Ok, so a Metabones Speedbooster... they aren't cheap haha. I feel a little bit like I'm trending on water right now, with my lack of knowledge. But I guess, people like you are helping me find my feet.

I imagine I'll be buying things and returning them when I realise they are wrong for me.

Title: Re: Lens needed to film sports?
Post by: chrissie_c on February 09, 2022, 01:28:56 AM

Just a thought - get the camera and a nice fast lens and see how that works without the speedbooster, then save up for one if it seems necessary :)

Title: Re: Lens needed to film sports?
Post by: hutber on February 09, 2022, 02:08:12 AM

ha, that is fair!

So my checklist are:
SSD Drive
SSD Drive cable
Nikon > C-Mount

And thats actually it for the minimum to get videos onto disk right?

Title: Re: Lens needed to film sports?
Post by: Nikon1 on February 09, 2022, 05:40:09 AM

Quote from: hutber on February 09, 2022, 02:08:12 AM

ha, that is fair!

So my checklist are:
SSD Drive
SSD Drive cable
Nikon > C-Mount

And thats actually it for the minimum to get videos onto disk right?

Depending on what option you choose when you order The Camera, it does actually already come with the Needed Adapter for either Canon or Nikon Mount to C-Mount and a Spacer to CS-Mount, one of both is always included.
 The Adapter for Nikon Mount, that does come with the Camera however will not allow you to use Any Nikon Lenses that do not have an Dedicated Aperture Setting on the Lens itself, for that you would need to order a Adapter that can do that. The Included Adapter will work with any older Nikon Lens, that does still have such a setting on the Lens or Fully Manual Third Party Lenses with Nikon Mount.
 .
 Regards SSDs, those are sure nice to have, but are not required to use the Camera. SSD Memory is faster to save Footage to, for some File Formats even very dramatically faster, but you can also just use any SD Card (Some of the new and Extremely Big ones and some UHS-II ones might not be Compatible with the Camera, but almost any usual SD Card or Micro-SD with an Adapter Will work with no problems) you probably already own, or can buy a lot cheaper than an SSD (also more Compact).
 There is really nothing you would NEED a SSD for to use this Camera, it just makes Working with it faster, nothing else.
 So if you want to save yourself some money, and are willing to wait a bit longer for it to save Footage to Memory, you can use Standard SD-Cards as Storage. I would still Recommend to buy some high Quality Name Brand ones, if the Footage you Intend to capture is of Any Importance, as SD-Cards can fail, especially cheap bad Quality ones.
 .
 So given you own Compatible SD-Card(-s) and any Compatible Nikon Lens or C-Mount Lens, and order the Camera with the Nikon Adapter Option (included in the Price Anyways), the Camera is actually Ready to use out of the Box with nothing additionally needed.

Title: Re: Lens needed to film sports?
Post by: hutber on February 10, 2022, 10:25:49 AM

How does this look for the speed booster?
https://www.amazon.co.uk/VILTROX-Electronic-Reducer-Booster-Mirrorless/dp/B07KG5WDQG/ref=sr_1_4?crid=T9XMSR1UU46A&keywords=canon+speed+booster&qid=1644517431&sprefix=canon+speed+boosters%2Caps%2C62&sr=8-4
I bought a Canon 70/200 for football and fingers crossed :D

Title: Re: Lens needed to film sports?
Post by: magicikea on October 18, 2023, 06:49:06 PM

Quote from: Nikon1 on February 08, 2022, 08:52:15 AM

Quote from: hutber on February 08, 2022, 08:40:41 AM

Ahh ok, great. So its Lens > speed boaster > c-mount adaptor basically. Must more clear thank you!

Not Quite right. But almost.
 While you can kind of do that, and Adapters for that do in Fact exist:
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BeM7cTJuSm4
 https://rafcamera.com/adapter-mft-to-cs-mount
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rxkxCpFMPfs
 I would Highly recommend to use A Interchangeable Mount for the Chronos like a MFT-Mount, as that is just way more Reliable, mechanically Stable and User-Friendly.
 Krontech offers one for sale, some users including me made their own Designs, and i also posted a bunch of Stuff on the Forum to either Build yourself one to 3D-Print (Parts for the Published Design are not available anymore, but you should be able to modify that to whatever Parts you can find on Ebay) or to Make a custom Spacer for the Metabones Speedbooster (posted in the Same Thread, but never finished Posting that one, only about half way done, will finish posting that, if anyone asks me to).

snake io (https://snake-io.io/)

I'm also learning about MFT-Mount, really liking its clarity in every frame when recording. It's easy to see that this is a machine designed specifically for long-distance zoom. The information you share in the links is great