Author Topic: USB video streaming  (Read 281 times)

hummingbirdography

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USB video streaming
« on: September 06, 2022, 12:32:43 PM »
Is it possible to use the Chronos as a USB video classification (UVC) device? I think I already know the answer is "no" but was hoping to be proven wrong. I was considering buying one of those Sony Xperia phones which can be used as a video monitor for Sony Alpha and other UVC cameras. Sony made the first (and only?) phone with an HDMI input, however it has been over two years since then, so it's even harder today to justify a $1999 price tag on an outdated phone. It seems Sony abandoned the HDMI input idea, but is still making new Xperia phones with UVC camera monitoring and streaming capabilities. I think it would be really cool if we could get the Chronos working with these phones!

Nikon1

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Re: USB video streaming
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2022, 12:39:36 PM »
www.krontech.ca/wp-content/uploads/2021/09/Network-Control-v0.6.5-1.pdf
 See Page 4 : Remote Monitoring via Live Stream
 .
 This allows a 60fps Livestream to Software like VLC Player.
 I have no Idea, if that would work on Phones, but cant see why it wouldnt, given the Right Playback Software?
 Requires some Form of Network Connection, which, if i am not Mistaken can be Established via USB among others...?
 .
 The Playback has pretty noticeable Delay and is not real-Time, found it to be somewhat unstable, but still Absolutely Usable if you dont have an Dedicated Camera Monitor.
 .
 If you are at the Point of Considering spending 2k USD on an Dedicated Phone to use as a Monitor for this Camera, might as well just buy a decent External Monitor.
 That Kind of Money will get you one some Pretty Serious Hardware. About any relevant External Monitor or Even External Monitor / Recorder combo with maybe even a good HDMI Transmitter should fit within that Budget, if it needs to be wireless for some Reason.
 .
 Should be way Lower Delay for the Image, and a much more Stable Solution in my Opinion.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2022, 12:45:54 PM by Nikon1 »

hummingbirdography

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Re: USB video streaming
« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2022, 05:06:32 PM »
Hey, thanks Nikon1!

I'm aware of the RTSP server included in software version 0.4.0 and greater. It does in fact work with the VLC Player app for Android, but obviously requires the camera and mobile device to be connected to the same network, therefor it's unlikely this feature can be used outside of your studio (where you would probably already have a professional quality video monitor anyway). I tried, but didn't have any luck connecting the VLC app for Android to the Chronos via a USB dongle, and I suspect that's because of missing RNDIS drivers. Perhaps there are apps which can resolve that, but even if it worked, the RTSP feed can be choppy and unstable like you mentioned.

I already have an Atomos Shogun 7 too, which you are right- although it was expensive, it was still cheaper than one of these flagship phones, and is a tool dedicated to the job, therefor does a better job at it.

Unfortunately I cracked the screen on my Samsung Galaxy Note S20 Ultra, so I'm on the market for an upgrade. I believe this was the last Samsung phone to include a microSD card reader, which was a feature I heavily depended on for reviewing and quickly sharing footage from the Chronos while traveling. This lead me to the Xperia line-up, because it has the microSD card reader built-in (plus doesn't require a SIM tool to open it!), and these phones are designed for creators like us, hence the UVC and HDMI monitoring features.

The UVC specification is most commonly used by USB webcams. However it appears the Chronos software currently only supports the RNDIS specification- through which the WebAPI and RTSP servers are accessible.

I'm guessing a menu option would need to be added to the Chronos software to toggle between the current "USB Ethernet/RNDIS Gadget" interface and a UVC interface mode, similar to what Sony and many other camera manufacturers offer:
https://helpguide.sony.net/ilc/2110/v1/en/contents/TP1000660156.html

Newer Xperia phones are about half the price of the 2yr old Xperia Pro with HDMI input I was referring to.

I think they could offer a lot of convenience by...

* requiring less gear which is only useful for your camera
* being lighter weight and having a smaller form factor compared to video monitors with a similar screen size
* supporting wireless charging, more commonly found chargers, and external battery packs
* making it easy to review, edit, and wirelessly share Chronos captures using the built-in microSD slot
* recording 4k @120fps and/or high quality audio with an external mic (which actually stays in sync with the video, unlike the "Live Record @60fps" feature currently on the Chronos)

..so, I realize I sound like an Xperia commercial, but IMHO, these devices could be the perfect field companion to the Chronos if it supported the UVC specification (or if Sony decided to make another phone with an HDMI input).

Until then, the only work-around I have seen, is to use a HDMI to USB-C adapter. However for that, Sony states "quality and functionality not guaranteed"  ???

Nikon1

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Re: USB video streaming
« Reply #3 on: September 06, 2022, 05:19:00 PM »
I honestly never even heard of that UVC Feature you where initially talking about at all before this.
 Also not a Developer for Software in any Capacity and also not in the Market of moving away from using my SmallHD with the Chronos / My Nikon which is just a neat Solid Setup.
 So if that is even Possible to do on the Hardware side of the Chronos, probably best to ask the Guys at Krontech if they Have any interest of Implementing that at any Point.
 Other than that, i hope you find some Kind of good and easy solution for this as well as a good Replacement Phone that fits your daily Needs.

Nikon1

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Re: USB video streaming
« Reply #4 on: September 06, 2022, 05:24:24 PM »
Dont really have much time to look into that right now, but another Idea to look into would be some kind of HDMI Capture Cards, if that exists for Phones? Like the Elgato kind of Products for PCs?
 Another thing may be some kind of Tiny Router, and a Ethernet Dongle for the Phone?
 Really dont have much of an idea about that kind of Hardware, never used anything alike (but still seems like Products, that probably should exist somewhere?), or how that would work in regards to Drivers...

hummingbirdography

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Re: USB video streaming
« Reply #5 on: September 06, 2022, 10:33:36 PM »
Thanks again for your responses Nikon1!

I'm thinking to pull the trigger on one of these Sony phones. I'll post again here if I do, and of course with the results from using it with the Chronos and a 3rd party HDMI to USB-C adapter.

I am a video oriented software engineer, so if the dongle idea doesn't work out, I have considered investing my own time in adding UVC support for the Chronos CLI on my own, and will try to coordinate software development for that with the Krontech team so whatever I come up with may benefit others in a future Chronos software version. I feel like this would be a fabulous compliment to the upcoming "Run and Gun" mode they worked on this year.

Nikon1

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Re: USB video streaming
« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2022, 05:47:22 AM »
[...] "Run and Gun" mode they worked on this year.
 

 Havent heard anything about that yet, did i miss out on something? What is it about (/Features)?